: Hiya Rehd

: I think there are relative merits that can be assessed. And aside from the
: actuality of many designs assuming the external approach. My GUESS is that
: most designs would have some sort of baseline so that either approach
: could be overlaid.

Very true, but, for the novice or beginner, whatever is on the plans may be what has to be used, as a matter of simplicity. :)

(I would say that any design that does not include some
: sort of reference line or baseline is incomplete.)

I'm not sure that was an issue. That's a gimme! Who would put plans on the market and not have a reference line or baseline???

IF either approach was
: therefore attainable, what are the benefits of either???

Sorry, you lost me there. ???

: So for the external, you have to construct this 16foot by 2 or 3 foot
: monstrosity on the inside of your shop. You have to do it really well,
: accurate to say 1/32 every single foot of the way.(Or forever have to
: remember and remeasure). You usually have to cut double the number of
: forms (one for deck one for hull), and figure out another storage place
: for the half that you've just finished.

I don't think You have grasped my point at all. If the boat HAS to have an internal strongback, so be it, and you treat it just the same as you would anyway. ??? If it doesn't, as in the example I gave, you won't save anything in using your INTERNAL strongback. Not unless you go to the trouble of designing the forms to use one, and then haven't you lost the objective of "simplicity"??

Have to build a bench for that
: too? You don't get to see the full yak in context until seaming. And more
: and more and more.

I don't see that " SEEING your yak in context " has any true value unless you are afraid you aren't building a kayak. If you know what it is, then you just read the instructions, do the work and it will all come out in the wash. ?? and more and more and more...what???

: For the internal, none of the above, just a maybe a box beam. No levelers or
: levels required.

I haven't seen any instructions, books or text that didn't require you to square and/or level your forms before you started to work. Whether you use a strong/bench, strongback on stands or workbench with forms on top, you have to level it and square it up.

: It stays together in context for the whole process. ???????

: So if there's no choice?? But if there is a choice, and I would make it so,
: there are relative merits that can be judged.

: -mick

I whole heartedly agree, if there is no choice, you do what it calls for, and if there is a choice, why not build what will work for a multitude of boats, internal or external strongback, as well as making a more convenient work area??

I don't plan on building a 2 or 3' wide monstrosity. I believe I just mentioned Ted Moore's design. ??? Whatever you build or use will be in the middle of your workspace and be a nuisance if that is what you believe it to be. ?? So, IMHO, why not get the most, simplist, easiest and convenient use of whatever that may be. If you are just using stands, you have to walk back and forth every time you need something, set it on the floor, walk on it, or trip over it and a train of thought can be lost as well as a tool. As I mentioned before, this is MY train of thought, and a recommendation as to the original post. Not a flame war over strongback styles. You like internal, as do I, "when they are called for," and I like the use of both as a matter of conveniece and functionality.( is that a word? ) A difference of opinion, nothing more, and I hope this hasn't dismayed or confused Tom. End of debate. 8^P Good Night!

Rehd