Boat Building Forum

Find advice on all aspects of building your own kayak, canoe or any lightweight boats

Re: Also look at Umiak oars.
By:Mike Savage
Date: 3/6/2008, 10:35 am
In Response To: Re: Also look at Umiak oars. (Mike Scarborough)

: Kris-- I was kind of looking at it the other way around. When Europeans got
: their hands on early kayaks and decided to try their hand at it as a
: sport, they seem to have gravitated away from the narrow-bladed paddles
: favored by native kayakers.

: I've traced the Euro paddle back as far as Hans Pawlata, who "reinvented
: the kayak roll using a feathered paddle" in 1927. So I'm curious when
: and how the wide blade and feathered paddle came to be preferred over the
: Greenland-style original equipment paddle.

: Mike

Hi Mike,
Herr Pawlata was a white water kayaker, like many at the time. A long slim blade would have been a disadvantage with shallow water. Paddles may have followed oars and sweeps in design depending on where they were used.

Oars and sweeps on sea boats tended to have long slim blades, easy on the body for long hours rowing. No problems with the sweeps hiting the ground, either.
Oars for rivers tended toward shorter wider blades, the shallower the river, the shorter and wider the blade.
There were also short, wide double-bladed paddles used with kayak/canoe-like boats on fens and wet marshes. They took up less width than oars and could be used either on one side like a canoe in very narrow channels, then used as a double-bladed paddle in wider channels. In drawings I've seen the blades weren't feathered, not really decessary in marshes and fens with the wind shelter fron the banks.
I think the drawings were dated in the early 1800's, and looked like they were done by archetects. The equivelant to a photo.
Unfortunately, I don't have the book they were in and can't recall the name, but it was an English, London publisher, a 1920's reprint.

It's possible that the Euro is indirectly descended from those designs.

Mike Savage
South West Cork

Messages In This Thread

Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Tommy -- 3/4/2008, 12:16 pm
Re: Myths keep dreams alive part 1.1
Bryan Hansel -- 3/7/2008, 8:22 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Greg H -- 3/7/2008, 9:41 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Acors -- 3/6/2008, 10:00 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bryan Hansel -- 3/6/2008, 9:22 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 9:58 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Donovan -- 3/5/2008, 11:19 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Dan Caouette (CSFW) -- 3/10/2008, 9:02 am
Nah, can't be...
Dan Caouette (CSFW) -- 3/10/2008, 9:03 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
John D. -- 3/5/2008, 3:09 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
John Monroe -- 3/6/2008, 7:23 am
Re: Other: Newsflash for Tommy
Kris Buttermore -- 3/5/2008, 11:59 am
Re: Other: Newsflash for Tommy
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 12:52 am
Re: Other: Newsflash for Tommy
Kris Buttermore -- 3/6/2008, 2:14 am
Re: Other: Newsflash for Tommy
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 9:55 am
Re: Skip the BS, Here's A Question
Mike Scarborough -- 3/5/2008, 9:50 am
Maybe Here's An Answer
Paul G. Jacobson -- 3/7/2008, 4:50 pm
Re: Antique paddles
Mike Scarborough -- 3/8/2008, 9:25 am
Re: Skip the BS, Here's A Question *Pic*
Aaron H -- 3/5/2008, 1:18 pm
Also look at Umiak oars.
Kris Buttermore -- 3/5/2008, 11:31 pm
Re: Also look at Umiak oars.
Mike Scarborough -- 3/6/2008, 8:54 am
Re: Also look at Umiak oars.
Mike Savage -- 3/6/2008, 10:35 am
Re: If I Read You Right
Mike Scarborough -- 3/6/2008, 11:46 am
Re: If I Read You Right
Mike Savage -- 3/6/2008, 2:32 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/5/2008, 5:35 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 12:46 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/6/2008, 1:07 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 4:03 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1 *Pic*
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/7/2008, 10:47 am
New t-shirt design for determined paddler! *NM*
Charles Leach -- 3/8/2008, 8:08 am
Re: New t-shirt design for determined paddler! *Pic*
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/8/2008, 1:12 pm
Re: New t-shirt design for determined paddler!
Bill Hamm -- 3/9/2008, 1:48 am
New Paddling Group: The Dustbin Lid Paddlers
Dan Caouette (CSFW) -- 3/10/2008, 8:57 am
Re: New t-shirt design for determined paddler!
Mike Scarborough -- 3/8/2008, 1:56 pm
Re: New t-shirt design for determined paddler!
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/11/2008, 7:11 am
Re: Seconded *NM*
Mike Scarborough -- 3/8/2008, 9:13 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Todd Sullivan------WebKitFormBoundaryrBPL64w206cse -- 3/5/2008, 8:16 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1 *Pic*
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/7/2008, 11:50 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/7/2008, 5:56 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Mike Savage -- 3/5/2008, 8:33 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Etienne Muller - Ireland -- 3/5/2008, 9:14 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Robert N Pruden -- 3/5/2008, 7:26 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Mike Savage -- 3/5/2008, 11:52 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Alex Ferguson -- 3/5/2008, 3:51 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Chris Ostlind -- 3/5/2008, 8:33 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
John Monroe -- 3/6/2008, 6:55 am
Wow! That's what I get for not being online much..
Robert N Pruden -- 3/5/2008, 7:23 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Scott Shurlow -- 3/5/2008, 6:46 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/5/2008, 4:51 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Alex Ferguson -- 3/6/2008, 5:28 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
John D. -- 3/5/2008, 7:45 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Alex Ferguson -- 3/6/2008, 5:35 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 12:44 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
John D. -- 3/6/2008, 4:41 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Mike Savage -- 3/6/2008, 5:54 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/6/2008, 9:50 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Kris Buttermore -- 3/6/2008, 2:04 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/9/2008, 7:53 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Bill Hamm -- 3/9/2008, 7:51 am
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Kris Buttermore -- 3/11/2008, 11:10 pm
so when is that singularity?
LeeG -- 3/5/2008, 1:14 am
Uh, Tommy?
Greg Fojtik -- 3/4/2008, 10:55 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Paul G. Jacobson -- 3/4/2008, 9:53 pm
Gee. I can't wait for part II :) *NM*
Paul G. Jacobson -- 3/4/2008, 9:38 pm
Re: Other: Myths keep dreams alive part 1
Mike Savage -- 3/4/2008, 5:33 pm
Classic Cabin Fever! *NM*
Rob Macks / Laughing Loon CC&K -- 3/4/2008, 4:44 pm
Someone pee in your cornflakes this morning?? *NM*
Kudzu -- 3/4/2008, 1:49 pm
Ad hominem dressed in reductio clothing
Pozamua -- 3/4/2008, 1:37 pm
Re: Ad hominem dressed in reductio clothing
Robert N Pruden -- 3/5/2008, 7:16 pm
Re: Ad hominem dressed in reductio clothing
Bryan Hansel -- 3/6/2008, 9:25 am
Re: Ad hominem dressed in reductio clothing
Robert N Pruden -- 3/6/2008, 6:25 pm
Incorrect interpretation of intent
Tommy -- 3/4/2008, 3:40 pm
It seems you intended to be a jerk
Brian Nystrom -- 3/5/2008, 8:55 am
Re: Incorrect interpretation of intent
LeeG -- 3/5/2008, 1:17 am
Re: Incorrect interpretation of intent
Pozamua -- 3/4/2008, 4:18 pm