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Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
By:Nick Schade
Date: 10/2/1998, 2:12 pm

> Any thoughts on the longer paddles of the ancients?

> I know that they went out to 20ft, and had a pivot mount on the kayak, so
> you didn't have to hold up its weight.

> These seem almost to be poles! Which, jokingly, might be what I need on
> some of the shallow lakes around here. :)

> BTW What can you do to harden the tip? for pushoffs, the occational rock
> ...

I think a 20' paddle would just be damned inconvenient.

Some people think the greenland paddle is somehow mystical in its virtues. It is easier to pull through the water than wide bladed paddle of similar length, but this is because it slips more and the center of effort makes it feel shorter. The same ease of pulling can be given to a modern blade by making the shaft shorter, and this has the virtue of not using slip, which is inefficient, to make it easier. A narrow blade is not like a lower gear on a bicycle, it is more like a slippery chain. I don't know anyone who would think a slippery chain is a good thing. It makes more sense to use a shorter shaft which is a better analogy to a lower gear.

This also means that there is no advantage in wind. If the smaller blade is easier to push into the wind it is only because the wind has less to push against, and this means that the water has less to push against and the two effects cancel each other out.

A modern blade made of fiberglass which is really thin will tend to dive or stall if the angle is not ideal. A greenland style is easier to roll with due to its blade thickness. Operating as a wing it is less effected by angle of attack. A modern shaped blade will be less touchy if it is also thick such as a paddle made from wood. Most composite paddles are not made thick because thickness is more difficult to manufacture. A good wood modern blade does not have a tendancy to dive.

While you can not grip a modern paddle anywhere in the same way as a greenland style paddle, the longer shaft gives a huge amount of choice. For example a sliding stroke is very easy and effective. For an effective extended paddle roll, you don't need to grab the end like Pawlatta, just sliding one hand to touch the blade is plenty and it gives a good feel for how the other blade is set up. There are a few trick rolls that can not be performed with a modern paddle which can with a greenland paddle, but you can reproduce most of the moves with a modern paddle. A low stroke is just as easy with a modern blade. There are several very useful strokes that are only really effective with a modern style blade. For example a Duffek. While you can set up a Duffek with a greenland paddle, it really is disappointing.

All that said, greenland paddles are fun to roll with. Even if it is just because the don't look like they should work and thus you can impress woman with your ability to do tricks with such an odd thing.

Messages In This Thread

Greenland paddle links
Timothy - Toronto, Ontario -- 10/2/1998, 10:27 am
Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Brian C. -- 10/2/1998, 11:01 am
I'll build one :)
Brian C. -- 10/5/1998, 6:39 pm
Re: you should
Nick Schade -- 10/6/1998, 2:42 pm
practice for when I get stuck on an Island
Brian C. -- 10/6/1998, 3:01 pm
Re: practice for when I get stuck on an Island
Jerry Weinraub -- 10/6/1998, 7:12 pm
Re: Laminated shaft
Don Beale -- 10/6/1998, 12:46 pm
Re: Laminated shaft
Timothy - Toronto, Ontario -- 10/6/1998, 1:34 pm
is a ferrule worth it on a greenland?
Brian C. -- 10/6/1998, 10:22 am
Re: is a ferrule worth it on a greenland?
Don Beale -- 10/6/1998, 5:36 pm
reinforcing paddle tips
Paul Jacobson -- 10/4/1998, 9:11 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Paul Stomski -- 10/2/1998, 8:54 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Timothy - Toronto, Ontario -- 10/2/1998, 2:23 pm
Where I got the picture
Brian C. -- 10/2/1998, 4:04 pm
Re: Where I got the picture
Roger Tulk -- 10/5/1998, 12:44 am
Mr. Hitchinson's book has photos
Brian C. -- 10/5/1998, 11:02 am
Re: Mr. Hitchinson's book has photos
Roger Tulk -- 10/7/1998, 12:23 am
I guess we could contact a museum...
Brian C. -- 10/6/1998, 1:51 pm
OK, I did!
Roger Tulk -- 10/12/1998, 9:17 pm
Re: OK, I did!
Mark Kanzler -- 10/14/1998, 3:44 pm
Re: Mr. Hitchinson's book has photos
Mark Kanzler -- 10/5/1998, 11:53 am
Sorry, that's Derek Hutchinson
Brian C. -- 10/6/1998, 12:31 am
Don't know
Brian C. -- 10/6/1998, 12:25 am
Found the book
Brian C. -- 10/6/1998, 12:38 am
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Mark Kanzler -- 10/2/1998, 3:10 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nick Schade -- 10/2/1998, 2:12 pm
Mystical Greenland paddle
Jay Babina -- 10/5/1998, 10:10 am
Re: Mystical Greenland paddle
Nick Schade -- 10/5/1998, 6:30 pm
Re: Use what works for you.
Mark Kanzler -- 10/5/1998, 6:59 pm
Re: Use what works for you.
Nick Schade -- 10/6/1998, 2:28 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Timothy - Toronto, Ontario -- 10/2/1998, 2:47 pm
Wide vs. Skinny paddle blades
David Dick -- 10/6/1998, 9:14 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nick Schade -- 10/2/1998, 7:53 pm
length vs sprint/endurance
Brian C. -- 10/7/1998, 3:20 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Mark Kanzler -- 10/4/1998, 11:15 am
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nolan Penney -- 10/5/1998, 6:37 am
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nick Schade -- 10/6/1998, 6:25 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nolan Penney -- 10/7/1998, 6:53 am
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nick Schade -- 10/7/1998, 2:09 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nolan Penney -- 10/7/1998, 3:21 pm
Re: Paddle flutter
Timothy - Toronto, Ontario -- 10/7/1998, 2:47 pm
Re: Paddle flutter
Nick Schade -- 10/7/1998, 3:49 pm
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Mark Kanzler -- 10/8/1998, 12:55 am
Re: Length of Ancient paddles vs the Modern counterparts
Nolan Penney -- 10/7/1998, 3:17 pm
Re: Cadence
Mark Kanzler -- 10/7/1998, 3:29 pm
Re: Punchline
Timothy - Toronto, Ontario -- 10/8/1998, 8:33 am
Re: Cadence
Nolan Penney -- 10/8/1998, 6:57 am