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Update *LINK* *Pic*
By:David Reekie
Date: 9/8/2007, 8:39 am
In Response To: Re: freeship stuff + vers 2.78 link (mike allen)

: (and on the developability side, those side and bottom panels are so simple
: that they are easily made developable following the process outlined a
: couple posts back)

Exacly my original thought - they are not that hard a shape so surely there is a way to do this - which was why I started this thread.

So, an update. ToniV very kindly agreed to look at my model, which I sent to him - thanks Toni! He did some quick playing with the position of control points, while trying (by eye) to keep the same overall kayak shape, to show me what he (and Mike Allen) have been trying to describe and I've been too slow to grasp!

These changes were basically to vertically line up each set of control points on keel, chine and sheer which are connected to each other. He also removed one or two extra points on the sheer which were not connected to corresponding points on the chine and keel.

From Toni and Mike's posts it sounds like having these cross-panel connecting lines at right angles to the long dimension of the panel would be the perfectly recommended locations.

The resulting model still basically looks the same as my original design - alhough Toni is at pains to point out it is not 100% identical since he was working quickly, by eye. However, when you look at the panel shapes developed for each, the bottom panels are a *very* different shape. The original had a very pronounced concave towards the stern of the keel line, the new one does not. This is very obvious in the picture below which includes the original linesplan and panel developments at the top and Toni's new ones at the bottom. (Developability check highlighting switched on for the panel development in both cases). To see a bigger version of this comparison pic go to my building blog and click on the pic there.

These new panels look a much better shape to me given my experience actually building the kayak, so I'm right behind Toni and Mike - thanks for your advice, guys.

I've also been in discussion with Martijn, the Delftship developer, who had some different ideas which I've also looked at but which don't seem to me to be as helpful as Toni and Mike's suggestions (but I may be misunderstanding them). I've now sent the above info and revised model to Martijn, and will pass on any responses - but not for a week or so, I'm off on holiday, hurrah!

Dave.

Kayak building blog

Messages In This Thread

S&G: Delftship panel shape development *LINK* *Pic*
Dave Reekie -- 9/3/2007, 4:35 am
Just a thought...
Jay Doorly -- 9/4/2007, 12:02 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Bryan Hansel -- 9/3/2007, 1:59 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Bryan Hansel -- 9/3/2007, 2:05 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Dave Reekie -- 9/3/2007, 2:12 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development *Pic*
Duane Strosaker -- 9/3/2007, 1:26 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Dave Reekie -- 9/3/2007, 1:37 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
HenkA -- 9/3/2007, 9:53 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Robert McMurray -- 9/4/2007, 10:33 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Dave Reekie -- 9/4/2007, 11:14 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Robert McMurray -- 9/4/2007, 11:46 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Bill Hamm -- 9/5/2007, 2:19 am
Re: torture *Pic*
Robert McMurray -- 9/6/2007, 12:19 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Toni V -- 9/4/2007, 2:43 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
HenkA -- 9/4/2007, 10:08 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 9/4/2007, 11:01 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Dave Reekie -- 9/4/2007, 4:26 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Bryan Hansel -- 9/4/2007, 12:14 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
HenkA -- 9/4/2007, 12:37 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
HenkA -- 9/5/2007, 12:41 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
David Reekie -- 9/8/2007, 8:11 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Bill Hamm -- 9/12/2007, 4:53 am
bending ply *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/12/2007, 11:57 am
Re: bending ply
Bill Hamm -- 9/16/2007, 3:20 am
Re: bending ply
Bryan Hansel -- 9/12/2007, 1:30 pm
s&g (developable) surf kayaks *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/12/2007, 2:23 pm
Re: s&g (developable) surf kayaks
Bryan Hansel -- 9/12/2007, 11:54 pm
another s&g (developable) surf kayak: *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/13/2007, 1:30 am
Re: another s&g (developable) surf kayak:
Bryan Hansel -- 9/13/2007, 7:13 pm
a s&g freeship surf kayak - the 'rail' *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/14/2007, 1:33 am
Re: a s&g freeship surf kayak - the 'rail'
Bryan Hansel -- 9/15/2007, 7:45 pm
some freeship techniques *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/16/2007, 3:46 am
Re: some freeship techniques
Bryan Hansel -- 9/17/2007, 5:04 pm
more freeship techniques *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/18/2007, 2:33 am
Re: more freeship techniques
Bryan Hansel -- 9/18/2007, 9:11 pm
control curve vs actual shape curve
mike allen -- 9/18/2007, 9:46 pm
Re: more freeship techniques
Bryan Hansel -- 9/18/2007, 9:07 pm
Re: more freeship techniques
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 9/18/2007, 8:56 am
corrupted curvature
mike allen -- 9/18/2007, 3:32 pm
Re: corrupted curvature
Toni V -- 9/19/2007, 6:49 am
Re: corrupted curvature
mike allen -- 9/19/2007, 2:42 pm
Re: corrupted curvature
Toni V -- 9/20/2007, 6:11 am
Re: corrupted curvature
mike allen -- 9/20/2007, 7:39 am
Re: corrupted curvature
Bill Hamm -- 9/18/2007, 6:43 pm
Re: corrupted curvature
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 9/19/2007, 12:56 pm
Re: corrupted curvature
HenkA -- 9/19/2007, 8:26 am
the magic *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/19/2007, 12:41 am
Re: Somebody has to ask....
TOM RAYMOND -- 9/19/2007, 12:16 pm
Re: Somebody has to ask.... *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/20/2007, 3:02 pm
Re: Somebody has to ask....
TOM RAYMOND -- 9/20/2007, 4:32 pm
some are a little more normal *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/21/2007, 3:58 am
Re: some are a little more normal
Bryan Hansel -- 9/21/2007, 8:33 am
Re: some are a little more normal
mike allen -- 9/21/2007, 12:16 pm
freeship sketch version of 'solitude 15' *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/22/2007, 6:33 am
freeship 'solitude 15' - 90 deg panel twist
mike allen -- 9/25/2007, 2:07 pm
Re: a s&g freeship surf kayak - the 'rail'
Ken Blanton -- 9/14/2007, 7:00 am
Re: a s&g freeship surf kayak - the 'rail'
mike allen -- 9/14/2007, 5:03 pm
'la ligne' - another s&g freeship surf kayak *Pic*
mike allen -- 9/14/2007, 2:18 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Bryan Hansel -- 9/5/2007, 1:09 pm
freeship is still continuing - at vers 2.78
mike allen -- 9/4/2007, 12:08 pm
Re: freeship is still continuing - at vers 2.78
Dave Reekie -- 9/4/2007, 1:43 pm
freeship stuff + vers 2.78 link *LINK*
mike allen -- 9/4/2007, 3:13 pm
Re: freeship stuff + vers 2.78 link
Toni V -- 9/5/2007, 4:04 pm
Re: freeship stuff + vers 2.78 link
mike allen -- 9/5/2007, 4:31 pm
Update *LINK* *Pic*
David Reekie -- 9/8/2007, 8:39 am
Update comments
mike allen -- 9/10/2007, 1:26 pm
Re: Update comments
Toni V -- 9/11/2007, 7:55 am
Re: Update comments
mike allen -- 9/11/2007, 11:55 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Toni V -- 9/3/2007, 10:27 am
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
HenkA -- 9/3/2007, 9:42 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development *Pic*
Robert McMurray -- 9/3/2007, 1:15 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Dave Reekie -- 9/3/2007, 1:23 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Robert McMurray -- 9/3/2007, 3:13 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Dave Reekie -- 9/3/2007, 1:14 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development
Toni V -- 9/3/2007, 2:47 pm
Re: S&G: Delftship panel shape development *LINK*
Daren -- 9/3/2007, 8:46 am